E470 | What KPIs You Need To Track

Today, Yves Gege and I go over one of our favorite topics, and that is Key Performance Indicators. These are better known as KPI's and they will tell you everything about your business and the areas you could improve on and put more effort into. If you're not tracking some of these more important KPI's within your business, now is the time. Enjoy!

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Podcast Transcript

Danny: [00:00:00] So there's all kinds of hidden fees within your business that are just part of doing business. One of those is credit. Processing. And for us, we didn't even realize how much we were paying in credit card processing with the first management software we were using for our practice. And when we switched over to PT everywhere, we just realized we were saving literally hundreds of dollars a month with credit card processing, with their partner with Card Point versus who we were using with our prior software.

This has made a massive difference. It's more than paid for itself. It allows us to decrease our overhead. It allows us to have more cash flow to reinvest in our people, in our technology, in our facility, in marketing and everything that's gonna drive the business. So don't get abused by credit card processing companies.

Make sure you're paying what you should pay. And if you're looking for a management software, highly recommend PT everywhere directly integrates with a processor makes it very easy and their rates are super, super competitive. So it's saved us a ton of money and it probably will do the same for you if you don't know what you are getting charged.

So head over to PT everywhere. Take a look at what they've [00:01:00] got. I think you really like it. So here's the question. How do physical therapists like us who don't wanna see 30 patients a day, who don't wanna work home health and have real student loans create a career and life for ourselves that we've always dreamed about?

This is the question, and this podcast is the answer. My name's Danny Matte, and welcome to the PT Entrepreneur Podcast.

What's going on guys? Dr. Denny here with Eve Gigi, with the PT Entrepreneur Podcast, PT entrepreneur Facebook group. And today, Eve and I are gonna go over one of our favorite topics, really one of his favorite topics, which is key performance indicators that you need to be tracking in your business.

This is a area that I feel like, you can speak to this much better than me here in a second, but an area that once we get a chance to work with businesses, if they are. [00:02:00] Unorganized in terms of what they're tracking. Once we get them consistently tracking the right things, we see massive changes in their business because all of a sudden they're making better decisions.

They're getting better information about where things are coming from, what things are dropping off, and then they start to make adjustments based off of the things that they want to improve versus, do I have more money in my bank account this month than last month? Awesome. I'm winning, or No, I'm losing.

And now we know exactly what we're looking for. And I think our other business partner, who is probably the one that, you're probably the least familiar with Jared Moon. So Jared was a fighter pilot in the in the Air Force. He flew f sixteens and I once had a conversation with him about flying those suckers at night.

And, it's not like you're. You're driving a car down the road at 20 miles an hour, you're flying incredibly fast through the sky at night. It's completely pitch black. And you have to make decisions not based off what in front of [00:03:00] you, but based off of your instrumentation, the data that you're getting in the actual airplane.

And I feel like key performance indicators are very similar in terms of data in the business and being able to make the right decisions based off the information you're getting. And otherwise, you're basically just like running your business with your eyes closed. So Eve, how do you feel about KPIs?

Yves: Yeah, no I think that's such a good analogy. We just flew back from a trip and you open your window. I'm sure this happened to a lot of people, you're just flying through a cloud, and like, how in the heck are they, do they know where they are in, in space and like, where's the runway?

And I, I'm freaking out. But obviously the pilot knows exactly what they're doing. And that's hope yeah. Yeah. Hope and that's kind of entrepreneurship in a lot of ways, right? We are doing a brand new kind of like performance based cash model. There's not a lot of runway here.

There's not a clear path. We're doing something fairly new. And I know for a lot of us, we feel like we're just flying through, [00:04:00] and like flying through this dark cloud and have no idea, what's working, what's not working. And we just have that lack of clarity. And I'm still shocked, although I shouldn't be right about how many businesses.

Don't have that clarity and aren't really tracking anything. Just as you said, like I'm doing a lot of these onboard calls and it's so funny, each time I do an onboard call, they need to put these KPIs together just to do the call with me. And they just have so much clarity just from putting it together.

And I'm shocked that they didn't even, they've never looked at this stuff before. They never looked at beyond how much money is my bank account? They've never looked at, this is how much money, gross revenue I made in a week or in a month, or this was my growth, or this is how many evals I book.

And I'll go through the whole list of these here in a minute, but they haven't looked at any of this stuff, so they're literally just flying blind. They're like, the only number they're looking at is am I making you know enough money? Which, whatever that means for them.

Or, am I making enough money to pay rent and pay my bills? Yes or no. And we probably should be [00:05:00] looking at more than that.

Danny: Yeah. I totally agree. And I think it's one of the things that. Is when I'm around more sort of seasoned business owners, especially those that have bigger businesses the, in the grand scheme of things, these, most of the cast practices are really small businesses.

A couple employees, growing. But definitely it's not like you're managing a hundred people. And the bigger that these businesses get and obviously there's significantly bigger businesses than even that, the more they have to be very detailed on tracking and understand like what's happening, where and where things drop off.

Because otherwise you just don't really know where a problem starts exists. And then how to solve that. And or if something is working, and this is something that we get a lot with people with marketing, even they're just like, I don't know where people are coming from, or, okay, if you knew that, maybe you could do more of it and then that would be beneficial to the business.

Or, I don't know why my revenue isn't. That great. And you start looking at it and you realize, [00:06:00] we had 10 people come in and one person did a package and everybody else dropped off after visit two. You're, there's your problem. You need to get better at sales. So what it does is it helps us diagnose the problem of what's going on in the business.

If the ultimate goal is for us to, make more revenue impact more people, grow a team, be able to have something that exists without us. These are just the things that we have to track, whether you like it or not. And usually people that get into this sort of type of business, they tend to be pull the trigger, ride the bullet, kind of people, jump out of the plane and build a parachute on the way down.

That's not the kind of people that wanna track things. I definitely wasn't like that. I spent a good two years just looking at, do I have more dollars in the account this month than last month? Cool. That was it. I wasn't tracking anything. So I think that for most people, They're gonna get a lot just outta this one podcast.

So I hope that this is very tactical. It's something that, you're like, okay, cool, I need to track these things. It's just a matter of whether you're gonna do it or not after this, right? That's the benefit of what we do with people is force accountability. That's the reason why we see progress.

Because [00:07:00] if you show up and you haven't done these things, like you're gonna look like a butt hole. And if you do that one time, people will, they'll be like, oh, okay, busy, whatever. You do that multiple times in a row. They just know that you don't care that much. And and there's a lot of peer pressure around keeping up with other people that are go-getters.

So let's start with this. Let's go over your KPIs and kind of talk through 'em a little bit. Yeah.

Yves: And these, the thing that you. Said the hit the nail on the head is like decision making. Like you make better decisions and think how key that is in the business to make good decisions. It's everything.

Sure. Here's some of the ones that we track. I added a couple extra ones, just because I like to dive a little bit deeper and I'm gonna try to not go too fast or get too complicated. Cuz if this is the first time you're hearing about KPIs, which is key performance indicators, which I didn't know that forever.

I remember like people were saying KPIs and I was like, what the heck is this? I understood it conceptually, but Right. These are just the key things in your business you need to track to, to see if it's performing really well. First and foremost what we track is just number of visits.[00:08:00]

And these are things that we track just by the way, you. More than this, but at a minimum, you're tracking this on a monthly basis, right? So how many visits did you do that month? Super simple. There's gonna be more to it than that, the other one is obviously gross revenue, right? Like how much money did you make that month?

The other one is number of evals. How many evaluations, how many new patients actually came in and saw you this month? Next is number of packages that you sold, right to those evaluations. We can dig a little deeper about recurring packages, but right now we're gonna keep it simple, right? How many of those evaluations, actually bought a package from you?

And the last one is average revenue. Per hour, right? You hear us talk a lot about raising your prices and there's a lot of other things that can go into that, you want to make sure you're making enough per hour to have a healthy business to bring staff on and things [00:09:00] like that. And the cool part is, we'll dig into this later, I'm sure is we've got really good norms here.

Like I know the KPIs for most cash-based practices where you need to be if it's healthy or not, which is re, which is really helpful, right? Oh, am I hitting these? Yes or

Danny: no? Yeah. Yeah. That, I think that's something that is very important to keep in mind because when it's so funny, I feel like people just spout off stats all the time and it's very hard to tell.

Where does that come? Is that legitimate? Is that one case? What's the size sample of that? It's really no different than looking at a research study, right? Like we all know how to do that, or we should after having gone through grad school.

And I think that's, As you look at the data that we'll share with you, and I agree, like I can tell you on average, if you're not at this average revenue per visit, like you're not gonna be able to hire somebody, or if you're in this city, you're gonna be spending this much amount per month on, a standalone space or a subby space, or this is about how much somebody cost this staff pt.

And the reason is, we have a [00:10:00] hundred and what 40 businesses or whatever it is at this point, just in our mastermind, let alone people that we're working with in our Rainmaker program. And that doesn't include people that we've worked with over the last few years. You're talking hundreds of cash-based practices that we've had a chance to work with, probably touching on close to a thousand.

So this data is, it comes from a pretty sizable, a pretty big sample size. And it's something that we've tweaked and changed and really stripped it down to the most important key performance indicators. We'll share this, this stuff with you and what we see as important.

But the biggest reason why it's so important for you to track this stuff again is so you can make the right decisions. And I think this is what. People take for granted until they have to hire somebody, until they have to look at if this standalone space is gonna cost me $4,000 a month, and I'm at, I'm making $10,000 a month.

You know it, am I going to be able to do that? Is and what projections can I ma make based off the space, based off the number of treatment offices I have, the size of it, the hours I can run it with. Can I raise my rates? [00:11:00] Does it change something? Does it, what's my overhead probably gonna be where I'm at?

What's my gross revenue? What percentage of gross revenue is rented costing me? All these things that are just pretty common, data points. Once you start to look at a bunch of them, it allows you to just be wrong less often and not make a catastrophic mistake, which I think everybody wants to be like, oh, how do I double my business?

That is a very, I think, important thing to try to achieve each year. I think it's also important to make sure that you still have a business at the end of the year and you making the wrong mistake, especially a big one in your business model or just tracking the wrong things can put you out of the game versus being able to stay in it as long as you can.

So the first thing that I wanna touch on though, that you talked about, and these kind of go hand in hand, Our number of visits and then number of new evaluations, and then percentage of people from evaluations that turn, into package buyers. And why that's important. So how would you explain the relationship between the two and why it's important to build a track evals and then number of people that are moving over to a package?[00:12:00]

Yves: Yeah. I think a great way to explain that is to talk about a common problem that we see, right? Like we have so many people. Want more new patients, they come in and that's their biggest issue. They just need, they think they need more new patients and more new evals. Their visits, are staying stagnant.

Maybe they're stuck at five to 10 visits per week and they don't understand why it's not going forward. And that's when we look at what you just said, which is, are you selling packages? And if you are you selling them at this kind of 50 minimum, but more likely 70% rate. Because if we can tweak that one thing, implement that system, and do it effectively, we know that visits go up systemically from then on out. Yeah. With the same number of new patients. Because in a cash-based practice, new patients is hard and it's a huge pain point. But if you're doing this correctly, you don't need the volume of new patients that you would think you would need.

An outpatient practice where you're [00:13:00] doing like, Two to three evals a day. Like we're talking two to three evals probably a week to really sustain

Danny: and grow your practice. Yeah. And I will give you a really relevant story with this, because this was the second year that we had started our practice.

I remember I had a month where it was just me and I had 40 new patients in a month. And I remember looking back at this not too long ago, I was putting a presentation together and I had less than a hundred visits, a hundred total visits off of 40 new patients that I had that, that came in to see me in this little CrossFit gym.

I had it, office that I had. And my average visit rate was literally just over two. It was like 2.1 or something like that. And a lot of that was because I was just like, Discharging people really fast cuz I had some issues with money and charging what I was worth and working through some of that stuff.

But the fact that as a single provider, I got 40 [00:14:00] people in a month and many times in the thirties by myself, it is astronomical to me that I didn't grow faster than I did because I was basically shooting myself in the foot versus if I was even mediocre at package selling the way that we are now, and we'll talk a little bit about that model because it is the model that we've found to seem to be the most successful and replicatable over hiring people as well.

That means that 20 of those people should have bought packages with me. And if 20 of those people bought, let's say they're all 10 visit packages, 20 people bought 10 visit packages with me, I would've generated. Like 200 visits just off of that, and then off the other people, another 40 if they're each seeing me twice.

So I would've generated 240 visits that month by myself that again, I would've fulfilled over probably the next three months. But even still, that would've put me I, I wouldn't have needed a single new patient the next two months. For me to be where I was tracking, even with getting 30, 40 people in by myself.

The difference is one is a very high volume new patient game. That's, it is hard to win that [00:15:00] game if you're only seeing a couple people. The other thing too is how much of a change can you honestly make long-term? If you see somebody twice, it's very hard. You ha they have to be incredibly diligent to do homework for, weeks and weeks, not months after you see them The first.

And when we build this package model in, what it allows us to do is build a plan of care out to complete the, whatever change it is that they want to achieve and only have to pull their credit card out once, which really helps with retention of those folks. And if you don't do that, what you're gonna see is drop off around visit two to three based off of symptomatic change.

And people think that everything is good and they don't end up putting in the other work they need to do on the backend to create a long-term problem. And then the problem comes back and they don't think you're that great and they don't tell anybody about how awesome you are. So it's really a negative thing not to go that route from what we've seen currently.

And it's a great way of getting better cash flow in the business because not only, let's go back to the same scenario, like right now a package with us is about $2,000 for [00:16:00] 10 visits. So if I would've had 20 people. Buy a package with me, 50% of the people that came in, I would've generated $40,000 plus an additional, I guess eight off of the other people that they so almost $50,000 by myself instead of, whatever it was that I generated off of less than a hundred visits probably like $17,000 wherever it was, 16, 17,000.

Massive difference in terms of cash flow in terms of what I would've been able to do, hire people, and move to a standalone space. So this is why we tracked that. And in particular, if you have. My problem. 40 people coming in and you're just doing nothing with it. That's one problem. If you have two people coming in and a hundred percent of them are buying packages, we don't have a sales problem, we have a lead problem, right?

So now you gotta get more new people in the door. And then sometimes what happens is people will buy packages, but they don't actually come in. So they're dropping off. You're doing a bad job of connecting with them or communicate, communicating with them, or fulfilling on that, right? So what we'll see is a high package percentage, the number of [00:17:00] visits is good, or the number of evals is good, but then your total number of visits is low.

And that means you're not following up with them, they're dropping off. There's something going on there where you need to solve that side of it. So this just lets us know what are we looking at? What's the most likely problem and where do we start to solve it? Because it's not like you can just hit a button and someone tells you what's going on with your business.

Like you just really have to look at data and then start to make decisions from there, and then continue to.

Yves: Yeah, I think the analogy is perfect. We are essentially using this data to diagnose the problem as accurately as possible, right? And, slowly chipping away at the. The most likely answer, right?

Just like when we're seeing a patient, right? We use some subjective data, we use some objective data, and we use that data to make our best guess. And you're doing something very similar in your business, right? And most people are just using subjective data. I feel like I need more new patients, right?

I hear that all the time without any objective data behind it, which [00:18:00] it's useful, but leaves a lot, it's lacking quite a lot. So what,

Danny: what does that mean too though? I feel like. I, we have worked with practices that had no more than eight to 10 new patients a month and literally had three providers, right?

That were doing fine. And it de, it just depends. And I think that, it's so easy to just say oh, I need if I had twice as many new patients, Yes, for sure. If anybody had twice as much new business, their business would go up. But are you filling up a bucket with a hole in it like this?

This is a bigger problem that we see. Because if you're gonna spend all that time, money, and energy trying to get a new person through the door and you're putting them through a very inefficient machine, you're going to really waste a lot of time, money, and energy. When if you get a tight business model in place and then you start to fill that up and have an exit strategy in place, that's gonna allow you to increase lifetime value as well as help people achieve long-term health and wellness goals.

Like all of a sudden we see the difference between [00:19:00] somebody being able to make a couple a hundred thousand dollars a year on the high end in a, inefficient business model to literally seven figure businesses by seeing the same number of new people just by having a better business model that they put in place.

And then they feed that with the people they need that are new as far as clients go to get the business, moving forward.

Yves: Yeah. That's the, I think one of the best parts about this performance-based model. It's more about longevity performance on a bigger level, and another key performance indicator, it's a little more of a complex one, which is just lifetime value.

Yeah. If I only see somebody two to three times, or I can see them between six or 10 times. Cuz ul ultimately that's the vehicle that we're using, rethink packages works, it's very sustainable, easy to teach, easy to scale. But the ultimate goal is just to see people as many times as possible, to give 'em the best outcome possible and to have a healthy business.

Yeah. And that is honestly, ultimately we're looking for with the packages and the continuity programs. And you're right, we've seen some people who've [00:20:00] just killed it with that. And their business can grow with not a lot of new patient volume. Yep. And it's just, it's really cool to see.

Danny: Yeah, exactly.

Now from the front end and start looking at, some of the other KPIs, let's dive into some of the ones that you like that are more about like the revenue side of things and getting a better idea of where people are at on a monthly basis. Because again some of this is, I, if you're not used to doing this, it's very uncomfortable initially because you have to look at, you have to look at numbers, you have to try to organize things.

It's maybe not always that clean. If, especially if you're like I sold this package, but I haven't fulfilled on it yet, and then there's a dragon into this month, whatever. This is where it can get a little bit challenging for people. But as soon as they go into their bank account and they start looking at okay, here's where I'm at, here's where I finished.

This is what my revenue was. Oh crap. These were my expenses. This is how much money I had left over. Now all of a sudden people become very aware. What they're spending money on, what they're not spending money on, and areas that [00:21:00] they need to improve. So let's talk about some of the revenue numbers that you guys like to look at.

Yeah,

Yves: I feel like, you see this in the entrepreneur group, we, there's practices that come in, just like you said, and they're making not a lot of money initially, right? Let's call it one to $2,000 a month, and then they literally go in a month or two to $10,000 a month, right? And they're like, how is that possible?

I don't understand. And the first piece is what we just talked about. We literally just take those people and we add the lifetime value. So now instead of two to 300 bucks, they're now worth anywhere from one to $2,000, right? So like it's really that simple. The second piece, and this is more of like overall revenue is.

Increasing prices, right? Just charging what you're worth. And all of a sudden now not only are you getting six visits, instead of charging a hundred bucks, now you're charging anywhere from, 1 75 to 200. And the exponential increase in that is absolutely unbelievable, right? And that's why we track the average revenue [00:22:00] generated per hour because there's some fluctuation with packages.

There's also some fluctuation with pro bonos. So we wanna look at the overall health of the business. We wanna see how much money per hour you're making. We wanna see that probably around 1 75 to 200. I think, most of the people going above 200. I think one 50 can be okay, but really at this point everybody's gotta be above 1 75, I think,

Danny: for sure.

So gross revenue in the. Average visit rate is the other one that, that we want people to be really clear on. And that also has to do with how many comp sessions do you have in there? How many friends and family member, whatever lower price points business do you have in there?

Cause all of a sudden you're like, oh no, I charge 200 a visit. But your average visit rate is like one 40. And then we're scratching our head like, where's the rest of that? What's going on? And then we start to realize, okay, you're just doing deals with everybody. You're not gonna be able to scale that.

It's gonna be incredibly confusing for everyone whenever you try to bring somebody else on and. An admin and they know they don't know you and John have a handshake [00:23:00] agreement to do a cash, whatever, 120 bucks between each other. Like it's a problem. Versus making it very streamlined and consistent.

And I was listening to this podcast about Tesla the other day, the business model. And what was interesting is they talked about the fully self-driving, vehicle option which frankly is it's built into every single one of 'em. They just hit a button, they either turn it on or they turn it off.

Correct. It's there and they just raised their prices on it. I think in the last year it's gone up $6,000. For that option, for you to have that option activated in your vehicle and. That's pure profit for them. It's not like the equipment costs them anymore, and people on the back end can decide, oh, I do want to add that now.

And then they'll just upgrade it, basically update the software and add it to where it's usable. And there's a reason why Tesla's so damn profitable because they do shit like that. And they have a huge market share in this growing, portion of vehicle industry. But it's very much like raising your prices, right?

So they [00:24:00] basically just raise their prices. So if you're spending the same amount of time with somebody and it's not costing you anymore, and you go from one 50 to 200, and let's say that is your true change, and you have, a hundred people that are coming in, in that month, all of a sudden you've added $5,000 in profit, not gross revenue.

That's top line revenue, meaning yes, you generated $20,000, but if you had $15,000 in expenses, Then you netted $5,000. Yeah. But if you raise your prices, and you can't infinitely do this by the way, like you can only do this a few times until you get to the market Si or the market price that you should be at.

But let's say you're undercharging, you've added $5,000 by adding a $50 price bump to what you probably should have been charging anyway, a pure profit. That's what your family gets to take home. That's what you get to live off of. That's a massive difference. That's an entire salary for many people.

So that is an area. It's easy for us to say, right? It's oh, just go from one 50 to 200. We all know how sketchy and uncomfortable it is to go through your prices, especially the first one, [00:25:00] and get to that price point, effectively. But it's very important. And the reason it's important is because it's legitimately the same.

Your the same service, but you're charging what you should charge, which makes you in significantly more profitable in the.

Yves: Yeah. And we see this a lot, right? A lot of physical therapists and really now a lot of health and fitness professionals that we're working with are typically undercharging.

We really, I don't think we've, have we seen it yet? I don't know. It's oh man, I'm charging 500 bucks an hour. This is not working. We've gotta decrease your prices. We just ha, years in business between us and we have not seen that yet. What we're trying to get most people do is just to charge what they're worth, right?

To have enough revenue to pay themselves a decent salary, to have enough revenue to actually bring a staff clinician on and go get a standalone space so they actually can help more people. That's a, that's kinda the best part about what we're doing is really just, giving you more resources to grow your company to help more people, right?

Yeah. It's honestly that simple. And the cool part is we've already got the, servant's heart kind of [00:26:00] checked between our profession, and now we're just trying to make sure it grows just in a, in a. In a decent way, and I think it's honestly so fulfilling from

Danny: our end.

A hundred percent. What are the what are the other KPIs you had list on there? I feel like we missed a couple. Yeah.

Yves: We hit most of them. The number of visits, if you dig, number of visits, gross revenue, number of evals, right? Number of packages and average revenue per hour.

That's where we're typically looking at a monthly basis. The ones that you can dig a little deeper on, which we can talk about is, the percentage of people. Going into your continuity programs for sure. Which I think is really important. And then even just looking at lifetime value, right?

Is the lifetime value of each client going up And there's a lot of different ways to do that. Those are the ones, you can dig a little deeper on as well as like cancellation rates and things like that. But these ones that we've talked about, these kind of core five, are the ones that you can typically diagnose and make better decisions on and easy to track too.

Danny: Correct. One metric I would say for bigger practices that do [00:27:00] have other staff members to look at as well is what percent of schedule availability is filled for your staff providers, this is actually a really helpful metric in terms of. Looking at hiring from what we've seen, really 85% schedule filled percentages is hard to get past for very long.

Cuz we end up creating weightless and redlining staff members a little bit versus knowing okay, I'm training around that point. It's time to, to get another person in. Yep. And hire. So that can be a really helpful number to to look at. But a lot of this too is you can come up with your own your own metrics of this, right?

So let's say you're trying to figure out the effectiveness of some of the marketing things you're doing. This could be digital, this could be in person. But really it's just a matter of tracking what, what's coming from what, right? So if I'm spending, let's say I'm spending. A thousand dollars a month on an ad on Google or Facebook or YouTube or whatever, anywhere you can put ad dollars [00:28:00] behind.

You spend a thousand dollars a month on that, and let's say you get 10 leads, each of those leads cost you a hundred bucks, right? Let's say six of those people actually show up. So now you got 60% show rate. You 10 leads, let's say two of those people buy a package and then the rest of 'em are just, they basically cover the cost of the evaluation, let's say a hundred dollars.

So two of 'em buy a package for $2,000, you're sitting at $4,000. You spend a thousand dollars on ads, so you have a four to one return. Would you do it? Most people probably would continue to do that. Now they may look at that and be like, oh shit, I only got two people. I spent a whole month and I only got two people outta that.

Yeah, sure. Maybe it's not the most effective ad campaign that we just explained, but. You're four x each dollar that you put into advertising. So if you're not tracking that, what you might end up doing is being like, oh, crap, I only got two people outta that. I'm not gonna do that again. And you just completely screwed yourself from a campaign that you probably could have scaled and maybe you put $2,000 in and it scaled up to where you got four new patients, right?

Versus[00:29:00] w where you left it, or maybe you just turned it off. So even tracking local marketing like this as well, right? Let's say you do workshops or gym and you're like, all right, how many people am I getting from this? And just being very diligent about where are things coming from and where are they going?

And I think one thing that you brought up that. Is incredibly undervalued because most people don't even have anything in place for this or really even realize how much of a difference this makes in their business is what percent of the people you're working with are moving over to some sort of like ongoing continuity offer that helps them achieve a long-term goal.

This could be a digital coaching option. This could be a monthly or bi-monthly, visit. This could be a small group training program. This could be a one-on-one fitness program. This could be nutrition coaching. This could be any number of things that you want to do within your business that are ongoing revenue producers.

And if you don't get excited about, if somebody moves over to. Virtual coaching with us, right? Let's say somebody decides, yeah, I wanna do coaching with your strength coach. It's 250 bucks or three or whatever it is a month.[00:30:00] That extra 250 or $300 a month really doesn't look like much in the grand scheme of things each month.

But if that person sticks around for 12 months, now all of a sudden that's basically $3,600 sale over the course of a year. And let's say you can add a couple of people each month, that starts to snowball and it creates a a little base of recurring revenue that is thousands of dollars every single month just by being consistent about giving people an exit strategy.

And that is massive. Like I, people completely underestimate what recurring revenue does for you, but it takes a lot of the pressure off. It lets you make better decisions and you're starting the month with X number of dollars versus just zero, and you have to go eat what you kill every single month, which I think is a very stressful business model to just maintain long term.

Yeah,

Yves: what's easier? Is it easier to go drop into a gym, cold, cold call them, do a workshop, prep for the workshop, set up the email campaign, book that [00:31:00] person, sell the package, or is it easier to, after you've fulfilled on the package, you have a great relationship with that person to offer them a continuity program.

Like what's easier there, right? Yeah. Which one? So I think people understand how much that is low hanging fruit, right? Like just to get people into a continuity program, and it doesn't have to be everybody. Not everybody's a good fit. Like I think, to talk about these percentages, I think 10% about of people who do packages with us should go into a continuity program.

But yeah, the snowball effect on that can be a game changer, right? Like when I went to go hire my first PT in my cash-based practice, it was really easy for me because I had so many people on a continuity program. So I could count on basically my salary and overhead expenses and guess what? Every new patient I could spend a lot of time training cuz I knew we were taken care of.

Right? There's just so much benefit. To building that out. And I think we need to spend, honestly, a whole podcast probably. I was thinking today, like just on, continuity programs, how to build them, how to sell them, things like that. I think that'd be a good

Danny: one. [00:32:00] Yeah. I mean it's a huge emphasis in our mastermind.

It's basically the theme of our entire spring in-person event between the guest presenter we're bringing in that's gonna talk about that between what we're going over some of the things that we've been helping either build out or bringing people in to help build out, for our community as far as this stuff goes.

Because it's really if I could go back in time and tell myself anything, like I show up, almost eight years ago, in, in Atlanta it would be for sure dude, don't be an idiot. And discharge people after one or two visits. Give, get, that's, I guess that's a, that is in its own right part of the issue.

But Give them a reason to come back. And it can't just be because you want your business to be in a more solid place. Like it, it cannot be your integrity, cannot you. You can't sacrifice that because you wanna make more money. I think you start playing that game and you're in a bad [00:33:00] spot quickly versus what do you do that allows them to do what they love either better or for longer or less pain or compliments it in some way.

And I know for me, like I got to this. This conclusion from a patient that I've discharged multiple times. And she kept coming back to see me because she was trying to run a marathon in every single state. And she was in her fifties and she talked to me like a child. I rem like when she told me, she's look, I'm either gonna keep coming back.

You can help me work on this, or I'm gonna go find somebody else. What would you like me to do? And I remember feeling literally like a little boy and my mom was scolding me about something that I just didn't, I didn't see it at the time, and all of a sudden I was like, oh shit. Like she sees value in this.

I don't have to quickly discharge somebody. I, when I was in the army, I couldn't even get somebody back to see me for a month. So I had to give them like a month's worth of shit to do or discharge 'em quickly cuz we needed to make room for other people to come in. I didn't know. And she was just trying to do something really difficult that was important to her and I was helping [00:34:00] her train for with less problems and achieve her goals.

And there's a lot of value with that. So I think that we can provi provide a lot of value to people that's not just, Hey, solve your pain. Hey, quick, let's get you back to whatever. Which is one of the reasons why we like, all right, what are you doing for training? I'll give you a really good example with a guy.

His name is Ronnie. And Ronnie is somebody I worked with for on and off like for a while. He's a he is in his fifties. He's training jujitsu and he kept getting hurt and Jiujitsu was pretty rough. You can get hurt doing Jiujitsu pretty easily, right? But he kept hurting his, he kept hurting his hip.

And especially when he would get like on the bottom position and he would try to like bridge up and get somebody off of them, just required a lot of hip internal rotation that he didn't really have and. So after finally getting tired of doing this again, and like trying to get him outta pain for his hip, I was like, what are you doing for training, man?

What is it that you're doing? And he basically was doing bigger, faster, stronger workout that he learned in high school however many years prior was doing the same thing, even doing the whole time. And I'm like, dude, you're not doing [00:35:00] any sort of unilateral training. You're doing no rotational training.

You're not doing anti rotational training. Like you're not doing any mobility work. Ignore, what do you keep getting hurt? So we line him up with our strength coach, and to this day, he still trains with him. This is years later, he still trains with him. He doesn't get hurt. He competes in jujitsu, he does like tournaments, and he's doing great.

And a lot of it is because his training now matches up with what his like sport is, and he's getting hurt less. So think of that as an example of, yes, I, you could just charge this person, but what if you could help this person? Train more intelligently and on, honestly, on the backend, there's way more potential for us to help them there if you know what you're doing than just solving a, a pain issue.

Yves: Yeah. I think it's another reason we're using this verbiage around performance pt, right? We're not just there to help you diagnose an issue and get you outta pain. We're trying to get you to perform better, in your life or in your sport. And that requires some version, typically of continuity and regular training, right?

And it just provides [00:36:00] us, and I think you already said it already, to not really worry about the bottom line so much or how much money you're making. It's literally about how can I impact this patient, or impact my community in the biggest way possible. And our skillset as health and professionals.

Greater than, I think, than just range of motion, manual muscle testing, and a diagnosis. There's way more to it than that. And let's use that skillset to help people as best we can, yeah. And a lot of times that's ongoing continuity. It's programming, like you said, it's remote or it's in person, right?

There's just, we've got people who see us, two to three times a week, almost we call it performance training, but it's essentially like personal training by a physical therapist. And they absolutely love it, and they get injured less and they get a lot of value at it added on.

And I don't know. It's beautiful. And I wonder why we're not doing this more often.

Danny: It's, I think the most it's the biggest advantage we have over traditional practices where, we establish [00:37:00] a relationship in a very different way. We have a different skillset and we can help people improve in many areas of health and wellness outside of just purely my knee hurts.

I feel like the injury is a gateway for people, at least the way I viewed it, right? Your injury is a gateway for you to get in here for me to then help you change your life, long term gateway, trust and through, through many other things. Yes. Cuz I'm gonna talk to you about sleep and nutrition and stress management and your job and your family and the shit that's bothering you.

And the fact that you look at your screen instead of reading a book every single night, and that you're not tracking anything that you're doing and all these things that are gonna lead to better health. I build some trust via helping your knee feel better.

And now all of a sudden, we can talk about many other things that are gonna be more important for you long-term. And many people have these goals and to your point, I do think that this sort of like performance-based clinician is a really interesting hybrid that allows people to yes, solve pain, solve problems, but then also create long-term health and wellness [00:38:00] changes.

And, we do it w with digital programming, we did it, we do it with small group training, which is just like such a fun way to go about it in a small group of four to six people when our doc runs a class. And like misery loves companies. So people are in there together, but we can mix in things that we know are really important for them based on training these like archetypal shapes that, that we know the component pieces of those and the biomechanics behind it.

And yes it, we can build out whatever we want, but we have an understanding that a deeper level than most people do about why and how to modify and have a unique understanding of their prior injury history. Are you kidding me? It's a freaking. Anomaly of a provider that can do that.

And so many people would be willing to do that if they knew you did it and you're able to actually build a business around it. The ongoing lifetime value of these things. This is where I don't think it's that cool for people if they're like, oh, I'm gonna make, I'm gonna make $250 off this person this month.

That's not as cool as a $2,000 upfront package on paper. But the snowball effect of that and the consistency of the recurring revenue creates [00:39:00] so much less stress in your business. And it's something that's just delayed. It's fairly delayed. This is, this has happened in a lot of software as well.

Like we see this where all these sort of big upfront packages have moved to ongoing charges. Microsoft has done this Adobe did this, and I remember, like I read an article about the c e O of Adobe when he did this, he actually got fired because they used to do these re-up big packages, re-up packages.

And when he made this change, Their revenue took a huge hit and he was like, no, it's gonna be good long term. It's gonna be more consistent, it's gonna be better, it's gonna grow. And he, they let him go. And it turned out to be like the best thing that could happen for this business that is significantly more profitable now, and stable.

And c see a lot of people moving away from that. So us being able to add these, some sort of services on the backend that are recurring I think are really big. We did get one question here from is it Sean Coon asking, can you repeat the list of KPIs that the, that you mentioned?

Sure. So you can write 'em down. Yeah,

Yves: absolutely. We've got six key KPIs. Number one is number of visits that [00:40:00] you saw that month. Number two is gross revenue monthly. Three number of evals you saw, new patients that month. Four number of packages you sold to those evals. And the last one is the average revenue generated per hour.

And there's a lot of ways to get that. There's but I try to simplify it, especially if you're just starting this, which is literally just take your gross revenue and divide it by the number of visits. And there you go. You've got a pretty decent idea. If you're doing only hour long visits, obviously you've gotta be careful with some of that, count half an hour is 0.5, but very simple version of doing it is that.

Danny: Yeah. And most EMRs are gonna be able to break that up for you. I know with us, we use PT everywhere and that's something that we can see our average visit rate, cuz it'll basically take, it'll take the package, it'll break it up into visits completed. And let's say we have somebody in [00:41:00] there like a friends and family visit or something like that.

And then it'll just, it'll add that in and average it out over the course of whatever time domain you set. So something like that can be a really helpful way to go about it. And honestly, like even E even looking at an E M R, I think for people, they're like, oh, this is a cost. It's how much time is this gonna save you to literally just have the ability to pull some of this data?

It is gonna save you two hours a month. Good lord. That's worth it. J just that alone, right? So yeah, I think if you haven't done that yet, this is a great place where you can you can start to be more efficient with collecting some of these things and really start to look for trends.

So again, like an E M R, like a PT everywhere does great for things like that where you can actually see what are you doing, how much volume you actually have what's the average visit rate, packages, all that stuff, and have it all in one central place without you having to try to like, piece together multiple pieces of software, which we did for a long time.

Yeah.

Yves: That's why, we basical. Built some pretty robust spreadsheets, and the rainmaker and Mastermind people have access to those. Because the other cool thing is looking at trends, right? Like e when [00:42:00] things are going well, let's talk about that. Like, why are they going well, right?

Do I just have more new patients? Have I just sold packages better? Or maybe the lifetime value and the average revenue per hour went up. That's very useful data because I can double down on what I'm doing well, right? And I, that's very good information.

Danny: Yeah. Yeah. It's huge. I was talking to one of our team members today and he's pulling data to look at, a couple of different marketing campaigns we have, and it's like intricate, like teasing out, very small things.

Yeah. And he's spending hours doing this. But it's so important to us to have clarity because again, it comes down to if you wanna know something's working. Or if it's not like it, you wanna know if you have a winning campaign, you have a winning, offer. You have a winning messaging approach and a lot of these things I, we have so many different people that we have that we're working with actively or that we [00:43:00] have worked with.

It's pretty good, like as far as being able to get there pretty quickly because of what we know is working all around the country. But even still, demographics can be different. Niches can be different. It can take a little bit of time to figure out like what works best for you and your area and with your own personality within your business.

And if you're not tracking those things and you're not sure that if they're working or not, all you're really doing is you're blindly spending money and time on stuff that maybe is working great and maybe isn't working at all. And I always just hate to see people that they give up on things too early that are winners or they back things that are losers because they.

Track the right things and it's just something that, it's just not cool. Like it's not the cool thing that everybody wants to hear about me either. Trust me, I don't wanna talk about KPIs for 45 minutes, but here we are now. You gotta get excited about tracking these things because it is gonna make a massive difference in your business.

And if you have this vision of growing a business that you know is more than just yourself, and I mean for a lot of people, they want, [00:44:00] seven figure plus businesses and you don't get a seven figure business without significant organization. And tracking and understanding like what variables are important to your business and doing that for a long time, like it just doesn't happen.

I don't know a single business owner that has a seven figure business that isn't very clear on what the hell is going on in their business because it is just not gonna get there in the first. Yeah. I

Yves: think it's also a big reason we see some of this, we'll call it entrepreneurial burnout, right?

We'll see, and we'll get these people in our group and they're tired, and they may have a successful business, but they are worn out because they really don't know what's working and what's not, and if they're doing well, right? That's that, imagine just like blindly just running and you're not like running a race, right?

You're just like exhausting yourself, literally for no reason. You have an idea if you're making progress or if you're not making progress that would get really frustrating. You're probably not gonna last that long probably. Yeah. And, all we do sometimes is say, Hey, you're actually doing pretty good.

Here's some baseline metrics. Here's how you are compared [00:45:00] to other people. And boom, everything changed. That simple. They're like, man, I I was literally about to go be a real estate agent. Guess what? I'm gonna stay here. And now I'm, I'm like, awesome. Imagine how many people that person's now gonna help over their lifetime, yeah.

Danny: It's a great point. I I did some consulting when I was working for mobility wide with this special operations group. Kelly and I go to this group and we're working with their their medics. And the first day we just go watch some of their training to see what the heck's going on and what kinda injuries they're seeing.

And we learn more about their training process. And one of the things they do in their initial assessment is they, you get a r like a big backpack, right? They give you a place where you need to be, and they don't tell you how long what's the time limit. They don't let you know if you're doing good or not.

And sometimes you get there and they tell you that the next, like the next place is somewhere else. So you, you don't have a set distance and or time that you know you need to complete something in. And it is a complete [00:46:00] mental, just like. It screws you up. It's the hardest thing.

And everybody we talked to was they like, this is like the hardest thing that we did because they don't know when it ends. They don't know if they're doing correctly, they don't know if they're doing well. They get very little communication from instructors on purpose. Cause they don't want them to know how they're doing.

And it's literally psychological sort of warfare in a way. And if you're not tracking, if you're not tracking your business, like you're basically, you're just like creating a form of psychological, stress on yourself because you don't know how you're doing. You don't know if you're going the right direction.

You don't know if you're tracking or, and or doing the right things. And to your point, Eve. Yes. Now stress the shit out of you versus if you know exactly if you know exactly what you need to work on in your business and if you do that, then these numbers will improve. And if they don't, And let's say that happens, but then something else breaks, then you know exactly what you need to work on.

Then it's just a matter of you looking and tracking and like looking at the right things, tracking the right things, making the corresponding [00:47:00] adjustments. And it's like that in perpetuity. It always happens, something improves and then it breaks. You make it more efficient and it just goes and goes as the business gets bigger.

So yeah, if you don't know where you're going and you're not tracking the right things, how do you know if you're doing well? And also, if you're not doing these things, you're basically just literally putting a massive amount of psychological stress on yourself unintentionally.

Yves: Yeah. I wouldn't wanna live that way for sure.

I say this all the time and I feel like, I'm just gonna say it almost like every podcast, but I will pay anything for clarity, right? Just to have a clear like idea of like where I'm going and how to get there. Like how much would we pay for that, right? Hey, I, I'm gonna tell you exactly how to make.

10 to $20,000 a month. We've done it now with hundreds of people. All you gotta do is follow this formula, and come along with us and do it with a great community. It's just it's, it seems like a no-brainer, right? Like clarity is the hardest thing to get. It is literally the hardest thing to get right.

Like clarity and like how to make my marriage go well, or how to raise [00:48:00] my kids or, whatever, how to get a 500 pound back squad. If I can get clarity around that I'll just feel a lot better. And if I have no clarity. Yeah. Like we're, they're using that to literally train special forces agent and people are doing that voluntarily to themselves.

Oh my god, God a great

Danny: story. That's why I was laughing. I was like, oh shit. They're doing this to themselves. Yeah. And they spend a lot of time and energy trying to figure out just how they can make this so mentally difficult on people. And you're basically doing it to yourself if you're not, if you're not tracking certain things in your business.

And honestly, It's no different. Think of yourself as just on the, put your clinician hat on for a second. If you have somebody that comes in to see you, and you can tell them, look here, what's, here's what's going on. You're trying to squat right? And you have. Like you have 90 degrees of hip flexion and every time that you push yourself down to 120, cuz you're trying to go full depth, you end up doing something to your back because your back gets pushed into a flex position.

And this is the problem. So what we need to do in the interim is not squat that le that level, let's improve your mobility and control [00:49:00] through range. Let's slow you to load you up through this range and you're gonna be good to go. Does that make sense? Like all of a sudden people are going from why does my back hurt every time I squat?

They don't understand, right? Mechanically what the hell is going on? But if you can clarify that to them and you can show them and you can give them visuals and be very clear with your verbiage about what's going on and make it simple. And then it's just a matter of you need to do these two things.

We're gonna do this in here for the next week and then we're gonna modify, we're gonna adjust and we're gonna increase whatever we're doing at the next stage. And after that, then we get into this phase where we're reloading and then we get into this phase, we're testing new whatever. And clarity people will pay a ton of money for clarity with us.

Both. In our clinic as well as, in our our consulting company. Because clarity leads to outcomes. And I wish this was as simple, like it sounds simple when we say this, and I know if you're in your business and you're trying to get these KPIs, this is very confusing. Especially if you've never done it before.

And then it's just a matter of you holding yourself accountable, which I think is even harder every single month where you're like, okay, I'm gonna do [00:50:00] my financial meeting with myself and I'm gonna do my KPI meeting with myself. And there's nobody to hold you accountable. You don't have nobody to ask questions to or if you're doing the right thing or see where you're at or see what kind of performance you have in comparison to somebody that's around the same size as you in a different area or whatever.

Like these are all the things that can make a big difference that we've seen, at least within our own community. So I hope that, these KPIs and what we're talking about today helps you if you're unorganized and you're really trying to grow something that's predictable, that's way less stressful to run.

Like this is the path you have to go. I don't know any other. And you can't outsource this either. I think this is what people think too. Oh, I'm gonna hire somebody, or I'm gonna partner with, somebody's gonna do all this shit for me. It's no, that's not how it works. No matter what, you ha still have to be involved in these conversations, in this data and understand it.

Otherwise you can get taken advantage of by an employee or a partner, let's just say worst case scenario. And you're still not helping yourself become a better business owner, which means it transcends to other things outside of the industry as well, which is one of the more valuable skills you could be learning.

Yeah. [00:51:00] 

Yves: And let's be honest, you don't know what you don't know. Like both of us went years without tracking KPIs. And the goal here, with the podcast and everything we're doing is. Teach people what we've taken years to learn and a lot of frustration and probably both had like legitimate mental burnout and we just wanna say, Hey, like here's a simple thing that you could do that could solve a huge percentage of your problems.

Like just track your KPIs, look at them on a regular basis. Yes, definitely. Don't outsource this because there's something to be said about doing it for yourself and actually writing those numbers down You. Understand it more intimately. Can you do it for a couple years and then probably outsource it and just look at it?

Yeah. Maybe. But in the beginning you've gotta understand these numbers end to end, right?

Danny: And it's the, it's literally like the last thing I would hand off, right? There's so many other things initially that it's funny that people are, they'll hang onto forever and you're like, dude, that's a redundant, that's that's a repeatable admin task.

Like you should be giving that to somebody else. [00:52:00] Versus, I get this a lot with finance, with people with their numbers, and they're just like, oh, like numbers make my head hurt. I don't wanna look at this. My bookkeeper will tell me what's going on. Dude, your bookkeeper works with a hundred damn businesses.

She don't give a shit about your business the way that you should. Like, why are you. Why are you not even paying attention to that? It's because it's uncomfortable, but it doesn't mean that it's not something that's necessary. And I think that we have to be okay with that. And it is what it is.

There's certain things that we're not always gonna be able to do everything we want all the time. At certain stage in your business, you're gonna be able to do a lot less of the things you don't like early on. You need to understand everything. And again, it comes back to like, how do you know if somebody's doing a good job or if somebody is doing the right thing, if you don't even know how it works yourself.

Especially with some of these basic KPIs that, you have to track. Anyway, hopefully we hammered that, in enough talk about it forever. We could talk about and look if this is something that, that you're literally, you're like, look, Sounds cool. You guys sound like you know what you're talking about.

I would like to get some help with this. This is what we do, as far as this stuff goes. This isn't something we just made up. We use this with all the businesses that we work with. You can head to [00:53:00] physical therapy biz.com and just see what we got. See what we're teaching people learn a bit more about us.

Our other partner, Jared, we're updating it. We have a massive team behind us now that we, that is not listed on there. Between all the coaches we have and people that are working with us. It's, there's a lot there. You can learn a bit more about what we have going on and, if it's a right fit, like we can absolutely look at, if there's a mutual fit for us to help you with this and or not, right?

So either way, I hope you get some value outta the podcast. Even. Anything to edit on.

Yves: Yeah, I think. Which is really interesting. You know what the first K p I, before you do anything else is our five day challenge. That k p like go in there and like just complete that first. Like how many people don't even just have like basically it's a glorified personal budget, right?

Do that first and the amount of clarity that people just get from that, right? The amount of decisions we've had and feedback. Be like, oh my God, I can quit my job now and I can do this full-time just from doing that five day challenge. So I think that could be a good place to start. If you don't even know what we're talking about, you're like, oh my God, it's over my head.

Go do that first. [00:54:00] Get that k p I started in, you'll be surprised what you

Danny: find out. That's a great point. That's a, that's actually not to toot our own horn, but that's a really honestly, it's a well put together. Challenge. And if you do it, you're gonna end up with quite a bit of clarity about, how many people you actually need to see what you need to be charging, end up with a one day business or a one page business plan that's just very simple.

And something that, that people just honestly should be able to follow pretty easily. Yeah. And that five day challenge is in the Facebook group. So the very top of the Facebook groups, if you're not in the PT Entrepreneur's Facebook group head there, you get signed up, for it for free.

We put this challenge together and we basically said we want this to be better than most people's paid programs. And we put a lot of time and effort into it. And it's been pretty cool to just see the the feedback that we've gotten from people that have, that are literally like, oh my gosh I can do this.

And I think that's so cool for us to see because we know what it's like and it's it's cool to see people get excited about being, a clinician again and working with the people that they get energy from. Seeing that they can actually not just replace, but in [00:55:00] many cases, make more money doing something on their own, use their creativity, have some time flexibility back about when they're gonna do it.

It's just so many different options with that. It could be as simple as, hey, you want to, you want to raise your kids. Like we've had plenty of people that have come through. We had somebody that we worked with a couple years ago that text me this was a couple weeks ago, right before the end of the year, and she told me, she's Hey, I made $95,000 this year.

I'm working two days a week outta my house. I didn't have to put my daughter in in daycare. And that was like, that's what she wanted to accomplish. That was her goal, and that's what she did. And it's not everybody wants to grow this huge scaled practice, right? It could be as much as that.

And I think it's just it's just awesome. You hear stuff like that and you're like, man, this is great. They're making the profession work for the life that they want. And I think that's the coolest part about these practices. It can be many different sort of shapes that it comes in.

So anyway, yes, you can find that the PT entrepreneur's Facebook group, you're not in the go to Facebook and request to join. All right. I think that's it, Damon, by the way, dam is it Damon or Danon? Sorry. Danon, thanks for shouting on the podcast. Glad that you that you like it every Tuesday and Thursday.

Guys [00:56:00] haven't missed one in, I think it's been five years. So I don't plan to break that anytime soon. We'll see. Nice. Let's knock out, I don't have any wood around me, but not gonna break it anytime soon. Thanks so much for listening, guys. As always, we will catch you guys next week.

Hey, Pete, entrepreneurs. We have big exciting news, a new program that we just came out with that is our PT Biz part-Time to full-time, five a day Challenge. Over the course of five days, we get you crystal clear on exactly how much money you need to replace by getting you ultra clear on how much you're actually spending.

We get you crystal clear on the number of people you're getting to see, and the average visit rate you're going to need to have in order to replace your income to be able to go full-time. We go through three different strategies that you can take to go from part-time to full-time, and you can pick the one that's the best for you based on your current situation.

Then we share with you the sales and marketing systems that we use within our mastermind that you need to have as well. If you wanna go full-time in your own [00:57:00] practice. And then finally, we help you create a one page business plan. That's right, not these 15 day business plans. You wanna take the Small Business Association, a one day business plan that's gonna help you get very clear on exactly what you need to do and when you're gonna do it to take.

Action if you're interested and signing up for this challenge is totally free. Head to physical therapy biz.com/challenge. Get signed up there. Please enjoy. We put a lot of energy into this. It's totally free. It's something I think is gonna help you tremendously, as long as you're willing to do the work.

If you're doing the work and you're getting. Information put down and getting yourself ready to take action in a very organized way, you will have success, which is what we want. So head to physical therapy biz.com/challenge and get signed up today. Hey, real quick before you go, I just wanna say thank you so much for listening to this podcast, and I would love it if you got involved in the conversation.

So this is a one one-way channel. I'd love to hear back from you. I'd love to get you into the group that we have formed on Facebook. Our PT Entrepreneurs Facebook group has about 4,000 clinicians in [00:58:00] there that are literally changing the face of our profession. I'd love for you to join the conversation, get connect with other clinicians all over the country.

I do live trainings in there with Eve Gigi every single week. And we share resources that we don't share anywhere else outside of that group.

So if you're serious about being a PT entrepreneur, a clinical rainmaker, head to that group. Get signed up. Go to facebook.com/groups/ptentrepreneur, or go to Facebook and just search for PT Entrepreneur. And we're gonna be the only group that pops up under that.