E416 | Interview with Zac Lynch (Success in a Small Town)

Zac: [00:00:00] So one of the best ways to improve your customer experience, which we know will dramatically improve your business. Is to have clear lines of communication with your clients. And that's something that can be really hard with these multiple channels between email and text. And what you really need is to centralize that in one place.

And that's something that we've been able to do as we switched over to PT everywhere within our client's accounts. We can actually message right back and forth with them. They can manage their home exercise plan within there, and it allows us to really compartmentalize the communi. That we have with those clients, instead of losing an email in the inbox or missing a text, and then you're, it's very hard to dig yourself out of that hole because they feel like you're not very responsive, you know, with them.

And for us, it's made a really, really big difference. It helps make our staff more efficient. It helps us not miss things as much with the volume people that we're working with. And it's a really smart way of really compartmentalizing your communication with your clients so it doesn't interfere with the rest of the channels.

You have communication with family and friends and things like that, so I think it'd be huge for your practice to centralize it the way we have. Head [00:01:00] over to pt everywhere.com. Check out what our friends are doing over there. I think it's really cool. I think you really like it. So here's the question.

How do physical therapists like us who don't wanna see 30 patients a day, who don't wanna work home health and have real student loans create a career and life for ourselves that we've always dreamed about? This is the question, and this podcast is the answer. My name's Danny Mate, and welcome to the PT Entrepreneur Podcast.

Yves: All right, Zach. Very excited. Uh, Danny's on a little vk, so it's just gonna be me and you. We're gonna talk about cash-based practices, we're gonna talk about being in a small town. Um, I'm super excited because I really think that the skills that you need to be successful in a small town, this kind of community building grassroot relationships, is really what I think most of us need.

Those are the skills we need [00:02:00] to be successful in any cash-based practice. So I. Really pumped. Zach,

Zac: welcome man. Thank you. Thank you. I've been looking forward to jumping on here, so I'm excited too, man. Yeah, man. It's gonna be

Yves: good. Um, so I think the best way to start, I love, uh, starting this way is like, tell us how it all started, man.

Like, why, like, you know, you're from this town, right? And like decided to run a cash-based practice here. Like, you know, how did this all.

Zac: Yeah, so let me just go through like the details of like when I graduated PT school and everything. So, graduated PT school, um, at the end of 2016. So I've been out about five years.

And so, you know, when I moved to college, I moved away from my hometown. Not super far, but I moved away for about seven years. Um, and so when I graduated PT school in 2016, moved back to my hometown. Which is Marshtown, Tennessee. It's an hour east of Knoxville. So, um, you can kind of get to Johnson City or Knoxville, [00:03:00] like right in the middle, um, of those two bigger cities.

And so moved back here, worked for a larger corporation for, uh, a little under two years. And, um, anybody that's been in a larger corporation knows how it works. Like I was treating 30 people a. I was treating 30 people a day. I was, I had 30 people on my schedule. There's no way I was actually treating hardly any of those.

So I had like 10 minutes of contact with each one, 10 minutes of contact, passing on 10 minutes of contact, passing 'em on. And so I started thinking, um, I started thinking about like my life and how I'd spent almost eight years in college. And was that what I. Was to like get 10 minutes with one person from my hometown, which I lived in growing up in.

Did I want that to be my reputation? I moved back there and have a low quality like, [00:04:00] uh, reputation. That is not what I wanted because that's really not the way I was brought up. That's not the way that I saw myself. And so, uh, in actually here in like three weeks, it'll be three years since I launched, and so three years.

Um, I just totally quit that job. Like, you know, I had a solid income with that other, it was decent. I had a decent income with that other job, and I just totally quit hardcore. I didn't ease into it, I just quit it and jumped right in with zero, um, you know, zero surety that it was gonna. But I was so much happier, man, when I had zero people versus being spoonfed all these people and giving low quality because then I could grow it as how I saw fit.

Yves: Burning the shifts, right? You got, you got side hustle mode, which a lot of people do. I did the same thing. I burnt the ships and started totally over, um, and kind of just [00:05:00] trusted myself, you know, that, okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonna make this work. So, okay, so you decided. To take the leap. Um, you know, where did you start?

Did you start in the gym? Like what, like how'd you even hear about cash-based practices is just something that just came up on your own? I've

Zac: been actually listening to y'all's podcast, um, probably for like a year. And I had shot you probably like 10 random messages like every other month. Um, And so it was funny because like on my lunch breaks, at my other job I would hop on and listen to a podcast about cash-based practices and performance based practices.

Cause I wasn't doing cash, I wasn't doing performance. I was basically doing post-op, um, and balance training and stuff like that. Um, and that just wasn't my passion, you know? And so I started listening to what was possible. Cause I didn't know, honestly, like it was possible cause I hadn't seen it in PT school, you know?

Um, So, yeah, that's just kind of how I went about just jumping right in because I've always, in [00:06:00] the past I've tried easing into some things and, uh, it's just, it just wasn't successful for me. Be when I'm trying to give my energy in multiple capacities. So burn the ships, jump right in. I

Yves: love it. I, I think what's worth noting, and I'm, I'm thinking about this a lot.

Is this idea of performance-based cash-based practices, right? So like you have one side of the coin, which you talked about, which was balance training, you know, and post-op stuff, and you wanted to do performance pt. So I'm really curious, how do you define that? What's the biggest difference, right? Like obviously you say you're happier, right?

So like, you know what, what does the cash-based practice performance practice allow you to do that you weren't able to do?

Zac: Yeah, so I guess I didn't finish answering your other question too. Um, I, uh, I was doing CrossFit at the time and I still do CrossFit, and I started coaching about two months prior to quitting my job.

Um, cuz I had already been an [00:07:00] athlete there for like two years, you know, been an athlete there every single day, five days a week, six days a week, actually for two years. Never missed. Never missed whatsoever. And so, um, I started coaching because I knew that that would kind of get me in front of athletic, athletic people.

Mm-hmm. And it's really the only CrossFit gym in our town. And so, When I started coaching, I also saw that there was a little bit of lack in, uh, helping people get through their injuries and get back to CrossFit. I'm gonna say CrossFit because that's just kind of how I started. Um, and so. When I had, was in the stages of planning my business, I knew I needed to be coaching to be in front of these people, but I also knew I had to quit my job in order to be in there more.

So I started doing both really within two months. And so when I did quit my job, I moved over. I literally [00:08:00] got You ever seem like those, like Chinese looking curtains that like you just set up? Oh yeah. They're like little,

Yves: they're uh, yeah. They're like, they fold almost like. An accordion and you can just spread 'em out like that.

That's

Zac: basically what it was, dude. So I bought a table and a mini desk and that curtain and set it up in the back of that CrossFit gym, which I was coaching it. Um, and so I would coach some classes. I would work out twice a day because I wanted to be with all the people that were working. So I would coach, work out once coach work out again and just hang out in that gym where I was set up.

And so I kind of became, uh, intertwined with all the members and so, Like I was saying, I saw that there was a little bit of a need for more than just CrossFit. There was a need for, uh, movement. I mean, we do a really good job in CrossFit of helping people with movement, but there was a little bit more of a need for people that are injured [00:09:00] or had a injury coming into CrossFit.

And so that's where my performance based PT came into play. I saw that I could kind of combine my, uh, CrossFit coaching with my, uh, like rehab knowledge. Knowledge. And so that's kind of where performance PT came into

Yves: play. I love to hear that. Right. Like when I think about it, it's just more goals for focused, right?

As opposed to focused on range of motion or pain levels. It's focused more on what is your goal? My goal is to get back to CrossFit and my goal is to keep training, you know? And looks like you were able to focus on those things way more often than you were at the other.

Zac: Oh yeah, a hundred percent.

Because I got to see people too, that I saw them working. I saw their limitations, and so whenever they would reach out to me, I would say like before, after class, it wasn't like a hard sale. But I would give them some free knowledge and then they would go implement and if [00:10:00] they needed any help, then they scheduled a visit.

So they really got to know me as a coach. They got to know me as a a friend cause I was there to help. And then they trusted me and so then they would schedule a visit after that. So there's not like, you can't just hop into a CrossFit gym and hope to get all of the members like, I mean, I was an athlete for two years, every single.

I was a coach, I gave free advice, I hung out and then I kind of got them as a patient. And cuz they were a friend too at that point.

Yves: Yeah, no, a hundred percent. I mean, we talk about what's like the key to marketing and branding. It's, people need to know you, they need to like you and they need to trust you.

And it looks like you attacked all those three things. Right? And we get the objection and I said it, you know, in the post to kind of get people here. Was that you're in a town of 30,000 people, right? Like you know, and you've been in practice for three years. You've got an admin, you've got a strength coach that helps you.

You've got a PT [00:11:00] thinking about bringing a second PT on. Right? And I really think, and you just said it was the community aspect, like you've just ingrained yourself. I feel like in that community you put the time in. Right? So tell us a little bit about more of like what you can attribute, just being able to grow like you have in a town of 30,000.

Zac: Okay, so when I did, one of the biggest things honestly was, was being in that CrossFit gym. So a lot of people that are active seem to join that, that gym. And so I was in there, met a bunch of people through there. Um, I became a pretty good athlete myself, so, you know, I'm probably one of the top two or three CrossFits in, in the city.

So, That helped a lot, like build up a little bit of a reputation. Um, I started running some five Ks too. I ran some five Ks, so I'm not a good runner. I don't enjoy it. But I knew it was good for my body. I knew it would kind of get me around some people that were active. So [00:12:00] I started kind of getting outta my comfort zone with, uh, going to these, some of these races with some people.

So I met them that way. Some of the running groups, um, I joined B and I, which is like a business network. So I met with like 20 to 30 other business owners every single week. Hey, I'm still doing that actually. Um, my admin is doing that for me now. And let's see, what else did I do? Me being from that town, um, I was already a member previously at other gyms in the community.

So what I did was I just went to those gyms who I knew the managers of and talked to them. Um, so they knew I was back in. They knew that I was treating people and then when they started understanding that I was treating their members, they started referring more people too. So now I've kind of got a pull from like eight different gyms, probably.

That's my son over there. Yeah, there you go. Nice. A guy. Um, so I kind of got pull from like eight [00:13:00] different gyms in the community, uh, just because they know that, you know, we get the job done.

Yves: Oh dude, I love that. Right? So like, I think that's what people underestimate, right? They want like digital marketing or they want this like sexy new thing.

But like you just put in the, the, I call it the social equity or sweat equity or whatever to ingrain yourself in the community. I don't like to be a runner, but I'm gonna go run these five Ks. Like I've been to all these gyms, I met these people. I'm gonna go there and put the time in, right? Like, I'd love you to speak to like how much time and energy did it truly take to make sure that those relationships were solid?

Zac: I mean, it took a lot of time, man. Like you, like hop in and it doesn't just happen. Like doesn't just happen like that. You know, you've got to follow up with each and each and every single person. And what I did, I don't know how other people have done it, but what I did was I met with them in person. Um, I [00:14:00] attempted to refer some of my patients to their gyms, to each individual gym, so they see I'm building.

I'm one to give back to them too. I am friends with all of them on Facebook and Instagram. So when I see a good post, I make sure I like that post comment on that post. Um, I watch their Facebook Live videos and engage. Don't just turn it on like I actually listen. Um, And we're, even now, we're going around and we are providing some of these places, uh, with some goodies that we think that they would like too.

So, I mean, even three years into it, we're still mending these relationships and trying to get even better at it. So, I mean, how much time would you say, I mean, probably daily for three years,

Yves: right? Yeah. I mean, that's what it takes, right? Like the. We talk about it all the time, and you just said it was the law of reciprocity, right?

Like you've gotta give in order to get back, [00:15:00] right? And you've spent the time and energy like their stuff go on social media, trying to send them referrals and send them patients and. Lo and behold, now you are getting consistent referrals on a regular basis. I'm really curious. People love numbers, right?

So like how many referrals, you know, you've been a part of the Mastermind forever and since I've known you, you've be, you've had a wait list, you know what I mean? Like, you've literally been wait listed and you still probably see 30 plus people a week. So like, I'm curious how you've seen these kind of referrals creep up.

Like, where are you now? And like, you know, uh, yeah. Tell us a little bit about.

Zac: So we've done a really good job with, um, over the past couple years we've done a really good job with building these long-term re relationships with, with patients. So we'll see them. And, you know, we'll get them better, we'll help them reach their goals.

They, they may stay like and come in for like maintenance style visits, uh, or they may, you know, go on their own and then come back to us when they need us. So initially we, [00:16:00] I wasn't having a ton of referrals out for the first year, but then once year, probably once a year and a half came around, I moved into my own standalone space, which was super nerve wrack.

But ironically, as soon as I moved into that space, referrals shot up. I don't even know why. Like I just ha it. Maybe it was because I seem more legit, like I was in my own space, but I probably would say 10 referrals among them. And then, um, I brought on my, uh, pt, Dr. Maria Pbe. I brought her on in January, and as soon as she came on again, We went from 10 referrals to twen, around 20 referrals a month.

Like with, not really, not really changing a ton of stuff, um, except for maybe plugging her face in to our marketing on [00:17:00] Facebook and Instagram. Um, and then she started focusing on some other things that we were doing, uh, like pelvic. So she's working with athletes public health, and so we just started incorporating her skills more into our marketing and our referrals just seemed to shoot up.

Yves: Yeah, I mean, that's crazy to me. 200, like 20 people, 12 months a year, it's 240 people out of 30,000, which is a gigantic percentage of people. Right. It just goes to show you if you, you do that at scale to how many people that. You have access to like how many people actually need our services? Right. And what I love, and I think what Performance Space PT is evolving to is like you're becoming like, you know, Danny talks about this a quarter pack of their health, right?

You're becoming their like fitness, health, wellness kind of coordinator, like helping things out. Like you keep people long term, right? Because they almost like look to you for a lot of their health and wellness.

Zac: Yeah. So [00:18:00] what we've kind of gotten to now is, um, we're almost like a primary care in a way. So we are performance-based therapists, but when somebody has, uh, an injury or they feel like something's off in their body, we are the first ones to know about.

Um, it's not their primary care physician, it's not their nurse practitioner pa, it's not the ortho in town. It's us. So people are messaging us. Um, they're texting me, they're Facebook messaging. I'm available to these people and

we help them through that. Um, and, and that's been really cool to see the kind of the process of how that's grown.

Yves: Yeah, I mean, we've talked about it and I think the A P T A talks about this, you know, of like US primary care, physical therapy, and I feel like there's a lot of people in small towns, or even just in small sections of bigger towns that are becoming, again, like a primary care provider for a lot of these people, right?

Like, Hey, I want to get fitter. [00:19:00] Hey, I wanna get healthier. Hey, my back is hurting, right? And. Spurs on these conversations that are much bigger. Like I had a patient come in today who's working with one of our therapists, you know, and he, this is literally what he said. He said he hasn't not had a drink for one week his entire life, and he's gone a month without drinking because of the conversations he's having with our therapist.

Like, how freaking was that? Right? Like, we're just breaking through into. Other areas and really helping people change lives. And I really think that's what this stuff is about. And what, you've done such a good job in your, you know, smallest county, isn't it? It's only smallest county in 10 in east

Zac: Tennessee.

Third smallest county in Tennessee. We're

Yves: smallest county in Tennessee. I mean, it's just, it's just crazy, right? So, um, yeah, man, like I just love to hear this stuff. It looks like you're doing a good job of creating, uh, an amazing community around you. Now doing a good job of kind of expanding, right? Really having a huge reputation, you know, in your, um, small town, and [00:20:00] you even told me like you've had some fears going in.

Tell me a little bit about the fears kind of going in and how like that's probably gotten a little bit easier over time.

Zac: Yeah, so when I initially started, um, I, I don't really come from a family of like any entrepreneurs, you know, so we don't really have anybody in my family, like directly that owned a business and so.

I, I don't have any of that, of that background. I don't, I didn't get any, we didn't get any in PT school. I mean, we had, like, we created a business or something in PT school. I don't remember one thing from that. Like I didn't learn anything from that. So I had to learn these business skills. So that was the first thing that was, um, Nerve-wracking and scary was I didn't know about business.

I just knew how I wanted to treat people. And so the only way I could do it was to start the business and just jump in and learn. And that's what I found has been best with everything I do in life. Like just jump in and learn because if you just wait around and try to prepare for forever, like you'll never do it.

So you've [00:21:00] kind of gotta jump in and that's how you learn best. So that was, that was an issue and that was, that was a scary moment for me. Um, another thing was we had just bought a house, so, Um, you know, we had a, we had a mortgage to pay and my wife, she was a speech therapist and so she had a steady, steady income at the time and she was actually working two jobs in order to help us make more money while I caught and got it go up and running.

And so, you know, we had her income, um, but it really wasn't enough to last long term. So it was. You know, I had to get the job done or we had to figure something else out. So another thing I found in myself is when, when, you know, my backs against the wall seem to work a little bit harder, work a little bit better, and so I turned up the volume, um, and just did everything I could to make it work.

But you know, that was a scary thing. I had a mortgage to pay for and we were, we [00:22:00] had just gotten married too, so, um, Some of those things were definitely nerve-wracking. And then also the fear of failure. You know, like you don't ever want to get into something and then fail because we had these egos about us as humans that were like, oh, we're not good enough, or whatever.

And so that's kind of what I would tell myself. I, you know, I told myself it wouldn't work in a small town. Um, and, you know, I feel like we've kind of proven that wrong now.

Yves: I love it. I mean that's, I'm very similar, right? Like I need my back against the wall to kind of give me that extra little push. And I think that's a lot of us, you know, as clinicians in the healthcare world, you know, we're these, I'm trying to coin this term, reluctant entrepreneurs, right?

But like, it is the best way to learn, right? The best way to learn is to just, you know, be able. Take that leap, right? Like, and it seems like a lot of us, uh, for better or for worse, [00:23:00] just like you went through, were in a job, we're making okay money, not great money, you know, decent as you put it. And we just get super frustrated with.

Not being able to use our skillset. It looks like that's what happened to you, right? Like you just got to the point where it's like, this is not who I am as a person. This is not how I wanna treat patients. And it just became literally too painful that you just had to be like, all right, I guess I'm gonna go do this other thing that is super painful, but at least it's for like something better.

And it looks like that just gave you a ton of energy. And I think people underestimate that. Like how much energy you can get, you know, um, from just starting your own thing, like you don't. You're not exhausted, you're more of just like, you could keep going. You know what I mean? Like some days I know you got a lot of energy, you could just keep

Zac: going.

Oh yeah, man. So initially kind of, you were talking about how much, how much work it does take. I was probably putting in, you know, 14 hours. 14 hours a day and wanting to do more because I knew there was more I could do. [00:24:00] Um, and when I initially started, um, I wanted to do as much as I can, so I just had this recurring energy and I was working out twice a day, so I was getting even more energy.

Um, and so I just keep going and going and going every single day. And I kind of still am, you know, like I'll cut back a little bit on some treatment hours, but. I'm still not, I'm still working on cutting back a little bit more. It's hard to do, man. It

Yves: is cuz it's fun, right? Like, that's the thing. You realize it's almost intoxicating, right?

Like once you get that flywheel roll rolling in the right direction, you know, it just, you just want to keep going. You want to kind of see how far, um, you know, you can take it. So, um, maybe a good thing to talk about, like you're on vacation right now. You've got, you know, for the first time ever you've got therapists, uh, Doing work for you while you're gone?

Like, tell me a little bit about how that feels.

Zac: Yeah, so I was thinking about this the other day because in the past when I've gone on vacation, I wasn't able to treat any patients whatsoever. So, [00:25:00] you know, the business as a, as a whole lost a lot of money. Those, those weeks, cause I was spending money on vacation, wasn't making any money, and then we were wait listing more and more people.

So now having. Maria has been, has been great this week because she's able to kind of pick up, uh, with some people that need help, you know, and so we don't have to push them back further, uh, because we have built up that reputation where we want to take care of people. And so she's able to take care of these people and provide, uh, really good care cuz she's a great therapist, um, to these people while I'm gone.

And then Stephanie, my admin, she is, um, handling basically everything else. So she's handling the schedules. I saw earlier, uh, where we've had some reschedules for the week. She's handling all that. Um, she's going around to a couple places this week and, uh, just kind of keeping our name rolling throughout the community, so it's really like we're not missing a beat.

Like, you know, I'm not there to treat my load like I would normally treat, but we're [00:26:00] still moving forward and. Being seen in the community. And so Maria knows she's gonna go to a couple gyms this week, um, and be seen. She's gonna work out at our CrossFit. Um, like she does a couple times a week. Um, and so everything's still rolling and it's a good feeling, you know, I mean, it's a little, I will, I won't say it's like not a little nerve wracking because it is, because, you know, I've been there since day one myself, and so it is a different feeling having the clinic rolling without me.

But it's something that, you know, you told me two years ago that we had to get to, so we're.

Yves: It's a good feeling, man. I remember the first time I had that feeling as well. It's definitely a, uh, cauldron of absolute fear and anxiety. My clinic's gonna explode when I'm going and like pure happiness of like, oh my goodness, this is what it feels like, you know, to, to have an actual business, right?

Like, You could get hit by a bus and your business would still keep going. And that is, that's hard to do in any business, like cash business, like any business out there. So it's just, [00:27:00] I think it's just a testament, like you said, to the, to the work. Um, That you've put in. You know what I mean? Like that's just the bottom line and it's, uh, yeah.

Really cool to see. And what I think is the most amazing part is, right, the stuff that you just told me that your therapists are doing are the stuff that matters. Like you're out there, you get, you're, they're providing more value to the community and getting out in the community, and they're in there treating patients, right?

There's no talk of like, Insurance reimbursement. There's no talk of like the admin, I mean, there's admin side of things, but none of this like, oh man, I'm stuck with paperwork. Right? Like, you get to focus on thing. What I think, right? Like I'm biased, I think truly matters, which is like, how can we help our communities live, you know, healthier, more fitter lives?

You know? And, and that's, that's our only issue is to make sure that that happens through and through.

Zac: Yeah, for sure. And so, like, you know, even as with Maria as a pt, it's, it's a good setup for her too. She's able to treat these people one-on-one. Like for today, I think she has six people on her schedule, and so she's got an hour and a [00:28:00] half blocked off to be in the gym working out like, so she's able to, to stay fit as well and even help some people in the gym when she's working out and then get back in the clinic and help even more of those people, um, stay healthy and keep training.

So it's pretty

Yves: cool. Right. If you get that part working out is part of your workday. Right. And like I'm sure some people, you know, maybe if they're in a higher volume clinic to do this. Like, did you just say six people? Like did you say that like six people is a full day for your therapist? Like what, you know, how many patients does your full-time schedule?

The Sarah therapist typically

Zac: see? She probably sees six. Yeah. Um, so she's actually, if you broke it down to five days a week, she sees six. She's working four days a week. Yeah. So, um, She seemed probably a seven maybe, you know, in those days. Um, A whole day off and she gets three days off. She gets Sunday or Saturday.

Sunday and Monday off every week.

Yves: Right. I mean, just the [00:29:00] fact that it's six people a day or seven people a day. I mean, we know people out there that are seeing at a minimum, 10 to 12, some people into 15 to twenties. Right? So like, you know, and that's. Uh, don't get me wrong, it's still exhausting cuz an hour one-on-one is still exhausting in a different way.

Right? But like, by far, um, a way better work-life balance, you know, to be able to do that. And again, just to be able to spend time, you know, in the community and go work out and go hang out, and that's part of your workday, that's part of, you know, um, the value. And what I love seeing. You know, with a lot of people in the, in the, the Mastermind and really in the Rainmaker even too, is that more practices are hiring right now.

Right. So like at some point I can't wait to see it where it's like, where do you wanna go work? You can work at a hospital, you can work outpatient, or you can work in a performance-based cash-based practice, like people eventually, I think it's sooner than we think are gonna be able to have a ton of opportunity to do that.

And we've at least. You know, six or seven that are actively hiring right now. Do you know what I mean? So like, I just think it's cool, you know? And like you said, you're thinking about bringing a second [00:30:00] person on. So I think a cool thing to talk about maybe next is like, what are some of the challenges you think, um, for other therapists maybe coming on, you know, to a practice like yours, right?

Like, cuz it's, it's a change in mindset, right? Like, you're seeing people, you know, like you said, six to 10 times and they're staying with you long term. Like, what does that look like? How did you go through that training process with your new.

Zac: Yeah, a lot of it is, um, a lot of it is mindset and and confidence.

So, um, we've got a lot of the skills when we graduate PT school, but we don't really have a lot of the, um, confidence in providing those treatments. So, If you go about like you normally would and you treat somebody's shoulder, you rub on their shoulder or whatever and give it ultrasound or whatever, and, uh, you know, give it a little theban rotation and so that ain't gonna cut it, you know, that's just not gonna cut it.

[00:31:00] So that person will come one time and we'll never come back. So one thing was she had to be extremely confident and very smart, you know. As a pt, um, with helping these people get better. So that was the first thing was we had to make sure her, her clinical skills were there. Um, relationships and per how to build personal relationships was probably the second thing.

So if you're a great therapist, but. You can't talk, like you can't talk to anybody. Like it's not, you're not a good fit for, for performance-based pt because, and not in my clinic. You're not like, you're not gonna work for me if you can't talk to people and formulate a relationship with them that lasts long term because they'll never come back and see you.

Um, and then, you know, the third would, would be mindset was because if you don't feel like you can get them better, um, and you don't feel like you're adequate, Then nobody else will think you are either. [00:32:00] So you've gotta have those, those three things in order to really be successful in my clinic. And Maria has those, and that's kind of what I'm looking for in other PTs as well.

Um, another thing is like, is sailing. You know, if you don't know how to sell, um, then your, your business is not gonna thrive. You won't make it. Um, because. Sales. You know, I've, we, I've talked to you about this before. A lot of people have this, um, connotation of like a sleazy car salesman. When you're trying to sell things.

Everybody in this entire world has to sell something. Everything is sales. Everything is sales. And so if we're not getting a plan of carrier booked out confidently, then. The sale is not made, the number of visits plummets and the business hurts because you're paying at pt. So [00:33:00] they have to be really good at selling as well.

So I would say those are the four things.

Yves: Yeah. So I, I'll press you a little bit on that cause I think it's a great conversation. When you say selling, you know, what are you selling? Right? Like when you say specifically to that, like what do you, what are you selling? How do you get them to buy in?

Zac: Typically, I would say, um, when you talk about like selling a performance based clinic, I would say you're selling, um, a change in lifestyle almost. So like, uh, for example, if somebody comes into our clinic and they're really frustrated because they get shoulder pain with doing toes to bar and they can't touch their toes to the.

And a lot of us, maybe because of, uh, thoracic mobility, they can't extend their thoracic spine. So we explain to them why we need to increase their thoracic extension and then make sure that carries over to Tobar, so [00:34:00] then they can do a toaster bar, they can excel in their CrossFit workout, which they're paying a high membership for without having pain, and then they're excited about being able to do that.

That is what you're.

Yves: I love it right there. You didn't say anything about a diagnosis. You didn't use any kind of like jargon. Right? It was specifically, I can't do this and I want to be able to do this. You know? And that's what we're selling here. We're not selling snake oil. We're selling, like you said, a lifestyle change.

We're selling to be able to perform at something you love to do. Right. And that's, let's be honest, as soon as you change your mindset and you get your confidence, like you said, it doesn't feel like selling anymore. It. Hey, man, you can't run a 5K as fast as you want to. Let me. Get you there and this is how we get you there.

We need about six to 10 visits. This is what we're gonna work through. You know? Does that interest you? And a lot of people are like, yes, right? Like, yes, there's more to it than that, but it really is in a lot of ways, and I've taught this to a lot of people, it's legitimately that simple, you [00:35:00] know? And I think you're right.

You've gotta have the confidence to be able to say that, right? So like clinically, like you understand how that works. And I do think. The big one that I'm realizing it is, it is a mindset shift. I think us, as you know, uh, a physical therapist or some of these other health professions don't believe that we should be at the forefront of these problems, and we should be like, we should be the one solving these problems, period.

Right? Like, we have the perfect skillset. And so as soon as you make that mindset shift, it just opens up a ton

Zac: of doors. Yeah, so like for example, I had a yal, um, a week and a half ago, and this just sticks out in my mind. So I had treated one of her good friends for her knee pain, um, like two months ago.

And so her friend told her that she needs to come see us immediately cuz she's having shoulder pain. And so when she comes into our clinic, I know as a therapist I can't get her better in one visit. It's just, you know, it just doesn't happen. So we booked her [00:36:00] for, I think it was around five visits or so, and so we booked her for those visits.

That is technically a sale because she has understood that we need those amount of visits to get her shoulder back and get her back to doing the things she wanted to do. So that is how sailing works in performance based clinic. It's just that simple.

Yves: It's just buying into the plan of care, which all of us as medical professionals should be doing in the first place, right?

It just happens to be way more transparent, which we'll talk about transparency in healthcare, which is not great, right? It's just way more transparent. It's just us being very, very open and honest about what it's gonna take in order to get there, and they need to buy in kind of upfront in order to hopefully get the outcome that they want.

So, Yeah, dude, I, I, I love to hear that. Um, you know, we're just, obviously me and you are on the same page. It's. It's super cool to see. So I, I, one more thing that I wanna talk about, and we can kind of slowly start wrapping up here, [00:37:00] but like, how are you balancing all this? Because you've had, how many kids do you have?

Zac: I have one son. He's um, you probably heard a minute, a minute ago. Yeah, he's. He's 15 months. This is his first beach trip, so he's just having a blast.

Yves: Nice. So, I mean, you've gotta start balancing all this, right? Because, you know, all that was happening during the wait list, you know, trying to hire and like you're in the thick of it.

So like, maybe talk just a little bit of how you're trying to, trying to balance

Zac: all that stuff. Yeah. So, um, we have my son 15 months ago, and so at, at that point we made a, a decision for my wife to stay home to quit her. Which she supported us with. It's kind of funny if you think back to how things work.

Mm-hmm. She supported us with her speech therapy occupation, um, as I got this up and running. And so then we made the switch 16 months ago for her to stay home, and so that has been a huge help because she's able to spend time with my son. Um, and then I don't have to feel bad about him [00:38:00] being, you know, at a daycare all day long, or, I mean, that's everybody's own choice, but our choice is, is to not, and so me personally, that helps me feel better throughout the day, even knowing when I'm busy.

Um, but what I've started doing, which you kind of got onto me about, about 30 times, was, um, I made a block schedule and so I started blocking. Hours, which I wasn't gonna treat. So for the first two years I told you I was gonna do it, and I actually filled all those thoughts with patient visits probably for like two years in a row.

I don't think I ever blocked anything off, actually. So now I have most of Fridays, I'm not treating people. I treat people till like 11 on Friday mornings. Um, And starting in August, I'm blocking off half a day on Mondays too. So I'm slowly getting some of my time back because what happened was I got so extremely busy that I was treating over [00:39:00] 50 people a week myself, you know, back last fall in the middle of Covid really.

Um, which was interesting. But, um, That's a lot of time, man, like that's just 50 contact hours. And then I was emailing all them, texting them, making sure they were good. And so I was probably working over a hundred hours a week, like at that point. So then I started, I brought Maria on, which really helped.

Um, I kind of quit seeing every like a thousand things in my mind. Slowly, I'm kind of grabbing some of these hours back, which I'm using some of those for business, but I'm also using a bunch of those to spend time with my son, which I would've never been able to do. At another job,

Yves: right? And we say it all the time and like, it's just cool for you to talk about it right there and then like, you know, why do we start these practices?

You know, why do we choose this difficult path? It's really patience, ultimately. [00:40:00] But secondarily, or, or maybe first is like for time and financial freedom, right? You're able to come full circle, you know, gets to the point where your, your wife has the choice if she would like to work or not, and she gets to choose that and, you know, That's an amazing feeling.

We've got multiple people in our group. You know, I've got one, I hope to bring him on. Uh, uh, Patrick Suarez, where like, you know, um, his wife was in a job, you know, and, and didn't want to be there, and he got to the point where she was able to leave and, you know, and it was an amazing thing for them in their, and their family.

And then also to be how the, you know, the time freedom. We're like, Hey, I wanna block off. Right. Like I can choose to do that and spend time with my son, you know? And it was a big motivator for me, you know, when I had kids, it's like I looked at myself 20 years from now and I was like, at no point am I ever gonna get more than three weeks of vacation.

At no point am I gonna be able to take a half day and hang out with my kids. Like I no like that kid's super frustrating. So like now, You know, with, I, I think conservatively a very little work in the grand scheme of your entire life. You've gotten to this [00:41:00] point in three years where you now have time and financial freedom, right?

And like, and also doing what you love. And that, that gets, all we're trying to do is trying to get people to align those three things, you know, and realize the, the potential we have as therapists.

Zac: Oh yeah. So, uh, you know, if you think about these three years, they were extremely. And when you do think about the is scheme of things, so I'm 29 years old now.

I spent three years of my 29 years just grinding and I'm always gonna have that grind in me. Like I'm always gonna be grinding and, and trying to improve myself and trying to improve the practice in my family. But like, I'm not gonna keep grinding for 14 hours a day for my entire life. It's just not sustainable.

It's just not. So, let me speak on that for a second too. So if you do go down this road, you do have to know that, like you gotta put the time in and, and you have to dedicate that your time to growing your business. And sometimes that means [00:42:00] taking away time from other things, um, which was me, a little bit of my personal health.

And so that was. Um, mindset thing that I realized I had probably four or five injuries within a three month time span. So, and they were pretty significant injuries too. And so I started reflecting on myself, and this was a year ago when I was about, when I was talking with you about bringing Maria on.

And so kind of what helped me realize I needed to get it done, like my physical health is not where I needed it to be. So I was and am ingrained in this community as a healthcare practitioner and one of the healthier peoples in the community. And so, and one of the strongest people in the community. So I was having these injuries.

I wasn't able, To perform like I knew I needed to physically too. And so I started reflecting and realizing like, Hey, I'm not staying hydrated. Like I have an increase in cortisol. I'm stressed. I'm sleeping four hours a night. [00:43:00] And which was fine, which is fine for a while, but when you start doing that daily for two or three years, you have to make a switch.

And that's why we had to bring on Maria, um, in order to really help my health long term.

Yves: Yeah, I mean, there's no better truth detector in my opinion, than adding like stress to the system. Like something like that, right? Like you've got to be able to perform day in and day out, and you realize very quickly that that's a zero sum gain, just grinding, you know, day in, day out.

And I, I love that because if businesses for me as well has just forced me to be a better human being. We talk about this like, work on yourself first, and a business will literally make you do that, or you'll get stuck, right? Like, You have to evolve multiple times. Like, you know, I talk about this all the time.

You've gotta be a really good clinician in the beginning, and then you've gotta evolve to be a really good business owner, right? And then you've gotta evolve kind of where you're at to be a really, really good manager of people. Like if you can't be a good kind of leader for your team, you'll be stuck where you're at too.

So that's a whole different skill set, right? Like [00:44:00] we've gotta constantly involve and improve, and I don't know about you. That's pretty awesome, right? Like I continue to improve myself every single day, again, while doing something of love and again, while peeled a great time and financial freedom for me and my family.

And better jobs for other therapists too. Like,

Zac: that's it. That's it, that's it right there. And so I was talking to this lady in, in my hometown. Um, she, she does life coaching and, and she's super successful and we were having this conversation last Friday and she's super pumped. She's, you know, she makes BCUs of money, but she's super.

Because her success allows her to give success to other people so she can hire people and help them get paid well and help their families. So it's not about, it's not necessarily about just us as clinic owners. It's about what we can do for our employees. It's about what we can give back to the community.

It's not what goes in our pockets, because that's not what it's all about at [00:45:00] all.

Yves: Exactly right. And I think people that sometimes the misconception, like you definitely hear some of these musings of people like, oh, cash, PTs, greedy, or whatever. It's like, no, we're literally just trying to change the game because we care more about our communities, we care more about our therapists.

You know, medical professionals are burning out at a record record number, you know what I mean? And like, we just wanna provide a different option for them. Right? And this is something that we enjoy and, and excel at, and.

Zac: At the bottom line. Yeah. And that's what kind of, you know, when I start, when I start feeling like I'm super busy, that's what kind of keeps me going to, is knowing that we're making the difference.

We're getting people jobs that they would've never had without us starting this thing. And so that's where it's pretty cool to reflect on and see where we've gone from day one to now.

Yves: I love it. I love it. I feel like we should end on that note. That's just like too perfect to, um, keep going. Any other kind of words of wisdoms wisdom before we, uh, wrap it up, Zach?

Zac: Could you, you can be successful in a small.

Yves: I love it. People need to [00:46:00] hear that over and over and over again, right? Because it's such a common, uh, you know, um, people just are in denial, right? Like, this won't work anywhere. Like guess what? It'll officially work anywhere. If you've been thinking about it and you haven't pulled the trigger yet, do you know what I mean?

Please let us know. You know, just type in the comments, game plan. We'll reach out. We'll tell you exactly what you need to do. It's a hundred percent doable. If you have the will and you have the desire and you want something, Reach out to us. You know, we, we wanna help, man. Zach, I appreciate it. It's awesome you did this on your vacation.

Now go enjoy your vacation unplug and uh, you know, uh, thanks again man. Thanks for

Zac: having me, dude. Yep. See you. See you man.

Hey, real quick before you go, I just wanna say thank you so much for listening to this podcast, and I would love it if you got involved in the conversation. So this is a one-way channel. I'd love to hear back from you. I'd love to get you into the group that we have formed on Facebook. Our PT [00:47:00] Entrepreneurs Facebook group has about 4,000 clinicians in there that are literally changing the face of our.

Profession. I'd love for you to join the conversation, get connected with other clinicians all over the country. I do live trainings in there with Eve Gigi every single week, and we share resources that we don't share anywhere else outside that group.

So if you're serious about being a PT entrepreneur, a clinical rainmaker, head to that group. Get signed up. Go to facebook.com/groups/ptentrepreneur, or go to Facebook and just search for PT Entrepreneur. And we're gonna be the only group that pops up under that.